‘I Don’t Think He’s OK — He Has Nobody’: Kieran Culkin on Roman’s Broken Stitches in ‘Succession’ Finale (EXCLUSIVE)

SPOILER ALERT:This interview contains spoilers from With Open Eyes, the series finale ofHBOs Succession, now streaming on Max.

During their cover story for Varietys Actors on Actors, Claire Danes whos starred in a number of TV shows, including Homeland and FXs recent limited series Fleishman Is in Trouble asked Kieran Culkin whether hed ever done episodic television before Succession. The answer, even though Culkin has been acting since he was a child, was no.

Danes laughed, and said, So you just thought, No, Im just going to do the best one, and start right there.

Then retire, that was the plan! Culkin replied.

Greg Swales for Variety That conversation took place in April, five weeks before the end of Succession. In the series finale of Jesse Armstrongs Emmy-winning drama, Roman (Culkin), who throughout the shows arc could go from impish extremism to vulnerability in an instant, ended up alone at a bar drinking a martini. With his face banged up, and his stitches busted open courtesy of an overly aggressive hug from his brother Kendall (Jeremy Strong), Roman flashes a brief smile but whatever hes really thinking is indecipherable. Earlier, however, in a disastrous boardroom meltdown among his siblings Kendall and Shiv (Sarah Snook), Roman had decisively come to the same realization their father, Logan (Brian Cox), had long ago come to: We are bullshit We are nothing.

As part of our Actors on Actors issue, Culkin shared his insights for the first time on the finale calling Variety from Poland, where hes filming a movie. There was just one issue, though, since hed been so busy, and is so far away from home: I havent seen it, so no spoilers!

Well, Im going to spoil something. In the conference room scene with Roman, Kendall and Shiv, Roman is the one who finally crystallizes everything, really, when he says, We are bullshit. Can you break down that scene?

It was right there on the page, what Jesse wrote. I know we are bullshit, that that was written, but there were different versions that would come out. I remember apologizing once, because some other version came out. He said, No, its fine. Jesse and I were synced up about what the moment was for Roman.

Initially, it was written as more of a screaming match between Shiv and Kendall that got a bit physical, and he ended up throwing a phone, and they sort of scuffled. There was a discussion, a safety thing, because Sarah was actually pregnant at the time.

Jeremy and I are of the same opinion: We dont really love rehearsing. We know whats happening in the scene, lets just do it. But we also have to be safe, because there was a safety risk.

We thought maybe it would get to a place where Shiv was going to push him or throw something we werent sure. But when he went for her, I just instinctively grabbed him. And then he turned his attention to me. There were a few takes where we ended up scuffling, and really going for it on the floor. I havent seen it, so Im not sure what made it in.

He pushes you against the wall

And grabbed my face, right.

Its pretty violent.

Does it ever come to, like, slaps? Or do we ever go to the floor, or anything like that?

You wrestle, but youre not fully on the floor, no.

Oh, well, cool! There were some where I was on top, and I was smacking his head. There were times when he got on top of me and just punched the shit out of me. And it was very alive, because we werent sure what the next one was going to be, and how it was going to manifest.

Can we talk about the hug with Kendall, when he busts open Romans stitches? People have different interpretations of it.

Well, Jeremy and I, as I said, we dont really like to rehearse. I actually really hate discussing the scene, especially when I feel like I understand it. The worst thing a director could do is come in and describe what the scenes about, and what our characters are going through: We dont need to discuss it, we understand. Jesse had said something earlier in the season, which I agree with, which was: Whats funny is sometimes Ill write something with a very specific intention. And then the actor has their own interpretation of it. But when they play it, both work, so I dont have to come in to note you, even though I have a feeling you have a different read on it. It works my way, and works your way.

In that scene, when I read it, I was kind of confused as to what was happening. A couple of days before, we had to talk about the stitches, the prosthetic, and all that stuff. He showed me sort of vaguely what he thinks of how the hug opens up my stitches. I had my own interpretation of it, and I didnt want to ask him. And we shot it, and he seemed happy with it.

After the fact, I asked him what he thought that moment was about. And we did have the same idea which is great. But the thing is, if it was something else, it would work all the same. Because before I came to the conclusion of what I thought it was, I realized there could be two or three different things that this could mean. And it could mean everything all at once.

My first go at it is sort of was its a thing that happens. Which I know is sort of silly. But sometimes I dont want to overanalyze something, because in the moment, Romans not going to know why hes doing it, perhaps. So why would I know it? Sorry, it seems like Im talking in circles, but there have been times when I go to Jesse when theres a line that sounds like its just words, but there could be a meaning behind it. And Ill go up to him and say, This thing here, that just a ? And he just goes, Yeah, its just a . And I go, OK, great, say no more.

That sounds like maybe a lazy interpretation? But thats actually just what people do. So when I first read it, I sort of thought, This could just be a thing that happens, and nobody really knows why it happened, it was just fucking strange. And they might have to talk about it in therapy to figure out what it is.

But I have my interpretation. And I do kind of want to keep that one to myself too. Which is very unsatisfying toyou.

My interpretation was that Roman has been physically abused by Logan, and Kendall is kind of bringing him to heel. My wifes interpretation was that Roman is freaking out about being embarrassed, and Kendall is giving him the gift of opening up his stitches so its more clear why this person cant be the CEO of a company.

What was the Logan thing? What was yours again?

That Kendall, in his attempts to turn into Logan, was abusing Roman. Physically controlling him.

Interesting. I will say that one of your interpretations has elements that are in mine, and one of them not at all!

I guess Im the one whos wrong! Annoying.

Im not going to say! Theyre bothvery interesting, actually.

Courtesy of HBO Roman was very upset about Gerri being in the office for the final board meeting. In his last scene at the bar, is he drinking that martini, and thinking of her? J. Smith-Cameron tweeted something about it.

Yes, she likes to have fun with her tweets. I have my thoughts on that, but I dont really want to put that out there. Jesse didnt write that in for that reason Im pretty sure he just said, orders a drink. So thats not a pointed Roman-orders-Gerris-drinkmoment, as far as Im concerned. Whether or not that was my intention behind it, I will keep to myself.

What do you think that final scene of Roman means about where you see Roman heading in this world, if this were a season finale and not a series finale?

Where do I think he goes from here?

There are people who think that Roman is going to be just fine, more than any of the characters.

But thats not saying very much, is it? None of the siblings are in a particularly good place at the end. Ive heard that interpretation, and I think thats interesting. A lot of people just go, Well, hes got tons of money hell be fine! Which just isnt really the case for these people. I dont think its as simple as, Well, I guess Ive got my riches and my martini, Im fine.I dont think hes OK.No.

I remember on that day, Jesse said, Do you want to talk about this moment, or not? I said, No, lets just shoot it. Because I didnt want to hear what it was. Because I had my own idea. He has said that he thinks its more of like, Roman has gone back to where he was at the beginning. Whats really sad about that was all of this was for nothing. Its been a waste of his time. Like, whats the point? What did he learn? What did he gain?

Which is a cool interpretation, and thats his, so that seems to be the one thats right.

But theres mine, which has, I think, elements of that. People inevitably do grow when they go through experiences like this. I think hehasevolved as a person. I dont think hes gained nothing from this. I think theres something he must have taken away from it, whether or not thats for better or for worse. The thing that gets me, even at the end of Season 3, was if Romans cut out of the company, and theres no reason for him specifically to come to the office and interact with his siblings, they dont have the capacity to say, Hey, I miss you. Lets get together and hang out.

I think he not only just genuinely loves his family, I think he needs them. Now that its done, and hes out, and theyre all out: When is he going to see them again? Who does he have?He has fuckingnobody.Thats it. And siblings are out there, somewhere. And its not like were gonna get together for a beer.Hes very much alone.Have you ever seen Roman with a friend?

God, thats terrible. In your thinking about this, do you think theres a world where they can reconcile?

Roman would be very much up for that, I think. But I have no idea! I love that there are different interpretations of it, and different theories. I love that, because all these things can exist at once thats why I think its great that it ended where it did. It feels very much like the end, but there could be more. Because there really could be!

I really do want to see what happens with these characters. But Im really satisfied sitting with that feeling of wanting more, and knowing that its over.

To thatpoint, though, do you think in your heart that youre really done forever playing Roman Roy? I know it just ended I know. And that Jesse Armstrong says hes done. But given the more of it all, and given his love of this project, which has consumed him for years, how could there not be a movie or a limited series or a something someday?

I mean because he ended it. I think thats it. That is the end. We dont all love to hear that. But you know, its the end.

Dammit. Why do you think Shiv shivs Kendall at the last minute? What do you think is happening in her mind?

Ooh, thats a question for Jesse and Sarah. God, I really need to watch the episode!

I feel like initially there was something in there where Roman was angry at Shiv for a moment about doing it. Like, he was embarrassed like, Hey, I put myself out there. And I look stupid now. I cant remember what it was, but then it ended up just not feeling right in the room. Because immediately when she did it, I remember instinctively, as Roman, feeling like, Oh, yeah. No, absolutely, youre right. It cant be him.

I cant exactly interpret what those feelings are. But in my gut, the moment she bailed, Roman was like, Oh, thank God, one of us had to do it.

The relationship with Gerri doesnt resolve, and I think J. Smith-Cameron said there was a scene that was cut from the funeral episode where she goes to him. What do you think of that relationship? Is it over forever?

Well, what does resolve mean? If this is a real, human relationship, what does that even mean? Are all your relationships tied up in a neat little bow in your life? It just doesnt really happen that way. I would be unsatisfied if I were given a satisfying resolution there.

She said in an interview that you and she have a plan to go to Balthazar and have martinis when you get back from Poland.

She and I and her husband did that a few weeks ago. She just texted me the other day, like, lets do that! Im not sure if its a double date, or just the two of us. They make a really nice martini there.

Courtesy of HBO You and Sarah Snook are both going into the lead actor categories this year, which makes total sense. And youre acting a movie right now do you feel that Succession has changed your trajectory?

I cant think in terms of that. The one thing thats an adjustment, that all of us in the show have talked about, was how the hell are we gonna work on something else? The way that we shoot is one of a kind. With the funeral scene, when we got there, [director Mark] Mylod gave this big speech to everyone, including a couple hundred background actors, additional camera crew, additional PAs, what the day was going to be. And he basically said, Were going to run the entire funeral procession without rehearsing it. Were going to shoot it with four cameras. And then were going to do that twice.

When we did the table read, Jesse had asked that we dont read the eulogies, because well just save it. So I specifically did not read the eulogies. This is shooting on film, so cameras have to keep reloading: We just did the funeral. And I didnt know, for example, what Uncle Ewan was going to say until he was up there doing it. And theres our genuine reactions to it. I didnt know what Kendall was going to do after he saved me. I didnt rehearse what my thing was I learned the lines, but I didnt know how it was going to come out. My understanding is the one thats in the episode was the first take. We just ran the whole thing.

Who the fuck does that? The entire funeral, which is almost half of the episode, we ran in its entirety. We never do coverage on the show. We dont do marks. We dont do continuity. All the things that are restrictions for an actor that youll do in any other movie, we just didnt do. Im not scared for another job? Im more worried about not having the same kind of freedom.

But Im out here working on this thing, and theres the initial bump of like, Oh, youre putting a mark down? Thats weird. Coverage! But its a couple of days of adjusting, and theres been some adjustments on their part too. Like, Im not given marks on this movie, so its loosened up a little bit. But its going really well. Its odd, because I think I went in with an expectation of feeling very agitated or boxed in or something. But its not the case.

Good!

In otherwords, Im looking forward to doing more stuff.

Is there anything that you want to say about anything the finale or Roman, or anything that I havent asked you?

No. Theres so much I dont want to say, and theres some stuff I said that I kind of almost regret.

This interview has been edited and condensed. Ethan Shanfeld contributed to this report.