‘Succession’: Ashley Zukerman Breaks Down Kendall’s Election Offer and Why Nate Is So Polarizing

SPOILER ALERT:This recap contains spoilers for Season 4, Episode 7 of Succession, now streaming on HBO Max.

The election looms over Succession, which means not only will there be a new president of the United States but, more importantly? Nate is back.

The charming or sleazy, depending on how you view him political strategist, portrayed by Ashley Zukerman, has reentered the world of the Roys in order to mingle with Waystars top brass and the political elite, and make Tom (Matthew Macfadyen) jealous in his own home.

In Episode 7, titled Tailgate Party, Tom and Shiv (Sarah Snook) host a gathering on election eve, at which Lukas Matsson (Alexander Skarsgrd) makes a surprise (well, to the Roy boys) visit. A double agent, Shiv plays informant to the GoJo chief in exchange for a key role in the company should the deal close. But the prospect of a Waystar-GoJo merger, which Kendall (Jeremy Strong) and Roman (Kieran Culkin) have been trying to tank since visiting Norway, seems less likely at the end of the episode, as Shiv worries she picked the wrong team. The Waystar co-CEOs believe theyve exposed cracks in Matssons bid to buy their fathers company, so much so that, by episodes end, Kendall is floating the idea of Waystar acquiring GoJo.

Nate, who had an affair with Shiv in Season 1, when the pair worked on Gil Eavis (Eric Bogosian) presidential campaign, shows up to the party with a fair amount of leverage. His new candidate, the Democrat Daniel Jimenez, is ahead in the polls, and Kendall has made him a covert offer: If Nate helps prevent the GoJo deal based on regulatory concerns, Kendall will make primetime safe for Jimenez, meaning Waystars right-wing news network ATN will treat the potential president nicely. Nate says he isnt comfortable with the proposal and leaves the party early.

Zukerman chatted with Variety about Nates moral compass, how he found out about Logans (Brian Cox) death and why the Succession fan base has split feelings over his character.

When did you find out youd be returning for Season 4, and did Succession creator Jesse Armstrong give you an idea ahead of time about how Nate would factor in?

I found out only a few weeks before shooting the episode. From what I gathered, there were a few permutations of the episode, and thats the version they landed on. Its pretty remarkable that after such a long development process they have a lot of options in their head, and they wait for the right one to congeal at the right time. But its funny Ive gotten similar calls over the last few years about potentially returning in other episodes, so I think they were constantly looking for ways to pull Nate in.

The scenes with you and Matthew Macfadyen are so delightfully awkward. What was it like developing that chemistry with him?

What a joy, and what an incredible performance. Im very fortunate to be in the show obviously, but Im also a fan. Im more audience than participant, and to see the work that Matt does is incredible. Its such a lovely dynamic, and whenever I do my preparation I forget how scary Tom is. All the scales are weighted against him. Nate comes in with the election numbers behind me, with the wind in my sails. Im gonna be their guy for the next administration. Its the best way you could show up at an exs party. And yet, as soon as I see Tom, theres some fear in me. Thats something that isnt necessarily on the page.

Is Nate jealous of Tom, or is Tom jealous of Nate?

One of the beautiful things about the show is that were all not really in the family. Even the family sometimes feels like theyre not in the family, that theyre not connected to Logan. I think Nate and Tom vie for place. Its all about whos closer to the center of this black hole.

Theres this moment between Nate and Kendall after he proposes a deal to you, and Nate says, Im not Gil, youre not Logan. Thats a good thing. How do you interpret that?

Theres this backstory between Nate and Kendall. Early in Season 1, Shiv referred to Nate as having run around in Shanghai with Kendall, which gave us this pretty incredible backstory knowing Kendalls history of drugs. I always assumed that we had a lot of big experiences together, and we were there for each other, and I was there for him and heard about his struggle with his family. So theres knowledge and familiarity there. Although were in different worlds now, we do know each other and see each other for what we want to be, rather than what our situation makes us. So thats actually a very honest moment outside of the games of the situation.

In a show full of awful people, do you think Nate has moral standards that separate him from the Roy family? Is he uncomfortable with Kendalls offer because he is ethical, or is he still just looking out for his own interests?

Like many things on Succession, its both those things. Nate tries to hold himself to moral standards, and hes found himself in a world that works for those moral standards, being on that side of politics. But hes also shown up at this party on election eve, hes probably playing hooky with other responsibilities he has because there is this gravitational pull toward this family. The way he indexes his success is to see what connections he can pull from, and thats a draw for him in terms of being at the party. Having a genuine personal connection to Matsson he knows that would be helpful for him in the future.

Nate can be thrown off his center by the Roys, and he has a certain blindspot because of the power they wield. Over the course of the episode, he shocks himself in how far he can slip in a few hours, until he gets schooled off camera by the Jimenez campaign, to pull his head in and get back to the roost. Those dualities play out in every character in different forms.

It might become clear to Nate as he moves around the party that there is a schism between the Roy siblings, even if Kendall and Roman arent yet aware of it. Does Nate still have feelings for Shiv, and could that sway his loyalties?

Hes certainly very susceptible to the push and pull of Shivs whims. I have no doubt that she wouldnt need too many breadcrumbs to lead him in her direction.

Succession fans are very split on Nate, with some arguing that he is a charming, good guy, and others who strongly dislike him a debate that I think is a testament to your wonderful performance. What is your take on Nate?

I find it fascinating. There does seem to be a lot of hate targeted at Nate, and he appears high on lists of the most unlikable Succession characters. He says he stands for something else, while the other characters at least dont say that. That doesnt really measure up to his actions versus theirs, so its funny what audiences react to. Someone who is seemingly honest about how terrible they are is somehow more acceptable to someone who is in conflict. Tom refers to Nate as one of our libs or one of the good libs, and that raises an interesting question: Who are the amenable libs to these people?

Its definitely made clear that for Waystar, it doesnt even matter who wins the election as long as they have a plug. As long as they pick the right horse, they couldnt care less.

Yes, its incredibly scary.

If Nate were managing the presidential campaign of Connor Roy (Alan Ruck), what strategy would he take to win the election?

I dont think Nate would ever run Connors campaign.I dont think.Hes not an operative at any cost. Its important to him that he believes hes on the right side of things. He can then maybe play hard, and he can work in the gray because of it.

Do you know how the show ends?

Not entirely.

Who would you like to see win the game of succession?

I dont think I should answer that. I guess the show is called Succession, and the question of who will take the reins is such a funny actually, I should stop talking.

Was it hard keeping Logans death a secret? Obviously, there is a reference in this episode to him having passed away, but Im assuming you might not have known that beforehand.

When I first read the script for Episode 7, I didnt even understand it. I had to text Sarah Snook and say, What does this mean? She didnt want to put anything in writing, so she gave me a very cryptic response. And eventually, I found out what it was that we were talking about. I was just as shocked as everyone else when they watched Episode 3.

But as far as keeping it a secret, it was nice to be in the inner circle for a little while.

This interview has been edited and condensed.